oc_NervA -Updated June11-

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Re: oc_NervA

Post by Funjob »

Are you running any sort of server side plugins along with the map? The Entdata on the map is really high, so memory isn't available. I'll take out some entities in the next version, I only tested with clean installs of OC, so I must have not noticed.
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Re: oc_NervA

Post by Ark »

Nope, just a test server without plugins.
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Re: oc_NervA

Post by Funjob »

Strange, I'll have to reduce the amount of entities in the next version.

Also, good news is that I have a way of compressing the files I choose into the BSP pretty fast.

Should I include the weapons inside the BSP? I think I tested this once before and it didn't work. Or is it possible to load parts of the model such as the materials or sounds into the BSP without any sort of error? The weapon skins alone are around 130MB because of the materials.
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Re: oc_NervA

Post by Shana »

I also noticed that when i try to run the map on a listen server it crashes with no free edicts, but on my dedicated server it works fine.

Also you can zip the weapon models and materials just fine, but not the weapon scripts. (Generally never should zip scripts in the bsp in case they ever need some tweaks e.g. mod update.)
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Re: oc_NervA

Post by fug4life »

It worked fine on a listen server for me, though my friend had the no free edicts error aswell. Remember that edicts are the network effected entities. So you can read as to which type of entities you should concentrate on cutting down on.
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Re: oc_NervA

Post by MaestraFénix »

I found two bugs, the first is very important:

At the end of the first part, when you have to kill the assasin to get into the elevator, if you throw a grenade, it activates and goes down, leaving you trapped in that corridor (when i and kan see it we laughed hard, and had to suicide to get to the next stage).

Near of the final stage, in the "open wide" stage where you have to jump to the left and get to a duct, the second door "ate" the briefcase, making (again for 3rd time) impossible the task of carring it to the end.
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Re: oc_NervA

Post by Funjob »

Okay, so it looks like the BSP totals out to 350MB with the weapons included. I thought there was some sort of file size limitation for maps (256mb) but it appears to load fine in OC. Writing the BSP was a different story though.

I changed most of the songs that were not looping into MP3s and took out files that weren't used, but packed for some reason.

I fixed the texture problems in this version as well as the elevator button. I should have also fixed the memory error, but I didn't really have a way to test it, so I don't really know. I also included the new .res and packed BSP. I figured no one else would use my custom weapons because of the damage and special bullets, so I packed it all in the map. I think it works, but I have no idea. I do know that it works perfectly fine on a brand new install of OC on a 64 bit 4gb ram windows 7 system.

Total file size for the 7z archive is 130MB. Unarchived is 342MB.
I replaced the one on the first download link, so here it is again:
http://fjmaps.com/maps/Oc_NervA.7z
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Re: oc_NervA -Updated June11-

Post by TESLA-X4 »

Did you rename the map (i.e. compile it under a different name, do not simply rename the bsp - it breaks cubemaps)? If you didn't, clients are going to start getting "Map differs from server" errors.

When that is resolved, I'll add a mirror for the archive file.
Last edited by TESLA-X4 on Sun Jun 12, 2011 10:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: oc_NervA -Updated June11-

Post by fug4life »

Maybe it would be helpful if someone wrote some mapping guidelines.

I mean all the things in this thread have happened countless times in the past, even myself took a long time to learn how to properly map for this mod making many mistakes along the way.
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Re: oc_NervA -Updated June11-

Post by Funjob »

TESLA-X4 wrote:Did you rename the map (i.e. compile it under a different name, do not simply rename the bsp - it breaks cubemaps)? If you didn't, clients are going to start getting "Map differs from server" errors.

When that is resolved, I'll add a mirror for the archive file.
No, the linkcounters on my site said "Not a lot of people downloaded this" so I took it's word and just replaced it. As far as I know, my site and these forums had the only link to it. I didn't want to rename the map because I would have to rewrite some of the map scripts. The last time I worked on the map scripts was over a a year ago. To be frank, I really don't remember what I did or how too much of it worked. I could have broken the scripts or taken a really long time to perfect them. Compiling the map for me takes about 4 hours. I honestly don't wanna spend much more time on this failure of a map. Plan B was to just release the fix before more people downloaded it. I would have just renamed the map if I didn't have to do anything else.

Besides, I think people would be smart enough to figure out to delete their version of the map if it doesn't match up with the servers, as long as server use this new version. I don't think the .res worked on the old version anyways, so file transfers between server and clients were a bust, meaning the servers can't really transfer the broken version anyways. In the end, if someone wanted to play this map so bad rather than waiting in the server for 10 mins to download a 300MB file, or figure out what's wrong with their current file, they'll eventually end up on this thread, and downloading the link. Hell, this is what I thought that would happen in the first place and why I didn't prep a res and release the map as it was.

Add it to your archive or don't, to me, it doesn't make lick a difference because I believe this map was a failure. Its inability to transfer from client to server in a timely manner is what made this map a major failure. Oc_Nerv has no place in this type of mod, or any mod in HL2. If I was going to go through all of these custom items, I should have just made my own damn mod or not made it at all.
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Re: oc_NervA -Updated June11-

Post by MaestraFénix »

fug4life wrote:Maybe it would be helpful if someone wrote some mapping guidelines.

I mean all the things in this thread have happened countless times in the past, even myself took a long time to learn how to properly map for this mod making many mistakes along the way.
I want accept the challenge. Where i should put it?
Funjob wrote: Add it to your archive or don't, to me, it doesn't make lick a difference because I believe this map was a failure. Its inability to transfer from client to server in a timely manner is what made this map a major failure. Oc_Nerv has no place in this type of mod, or any mod in HL2. If I was going to go through all of these custom items, I should have just made my own damn mod or not made it at all.
Liar. Worst maps are there and in another Source games, and you say that the yours dont deserve stay here? Ironic.
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Re: oc_NervA -Updated June11-

Post by TESLA-X4 »

Lol, calm down, nobody said the map was bad, so don't think that! Admittedly, the rather unwieldy file size is a bit of a deterrent, but I'm pretty sure people out there will be willing to help you fragment the map up into chunks to solve that issue (I know I would).
Apparently, Valve can't make games beyond the number 2.
I think the only time we'll get a Source SDK code update is when it starts having purchasable hats integrated, i.e. hatconomy.

Please do not make assumptions you are not knowledgeable enough to make - that just backfires on yourself.
Tick me off, and I'll be sure to give you the golden treatment. Haven't you heard? Silence is golden.
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Re: oc_NervA -Updated June11-

Post by Andrax17 »

well i have to be honest, i was bit dissapointed in the map. Design wise it was great (most beautifull designs ive seen in OC in a while)
but it lacked content, it was really short and only seemed to had series of small puzzles, it took us more time to do the light puzzle than the map as a whole.
It should have had a bit more action, none of the soldiers in the map moved, they just stood there waiting to be shot(excluding the beginning and the end)

one bug we found is that in the light puzzle, if you open the door and accidentally touch it, it closes and you cant open it again, forcing you to restart.

The annoucer guy is also very quiet and hard to hear, if there is any gunfire or anykind of small background noise, its impossible to hear him.

(the map isnt nearly 1h long..if it didnt have the light puzzle, it would be easy to do in less than 30min.)
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Re: oc_NervA -Updated June11-

Post by Philosogamer »

Funjob wrote:Add it to your archive or don't, to me, it doesn't make lick a difference because I believe this map was a failure. Its inability to transfer from client to server in a timely manner is what made this map a major failure. Oc_Nerv has no place in this type of mod, or any mod in HL2. If I was going to go through all of these custom items, I should have just made my own damn mod or not made it at all.
This work feels like an alpha. HDR makes the map burn your eyes (Everything else looks great except the really bright parts, IE before the overly-complex puzzle [A long puzzle calls for very unhappy players if it's something that is very static and uninteractive for the entire party. Maybe having soldiers come in whilst the puzzle is being solved {From behind} could ease this problem]) and the soldiers, whilst holding tremendously powerful weapons, just stand around and make the experience feel like they aren't really infiltrating the area, but just guarding it. Perhaps having better pathing nodes and AI that don't sit around would work (Don't ask me how, I'm not skilled in this field and can only comment as a "tester"), even if it means decreasing the power of the weapons. I'd take soldiers that I have to aim to hit with somewhat powerful rifles over soldiers who sit around with even powerful rifles blowing me away. Also, another idea to better playability would be to increase the volume of the directions that are given via sounds. If there is gunfire you really can't hear it, and whilst being accurate, can leave players to miss vital instructions (Extremely damaging through the first play through) and halt progress completely. And as Andrax has stated, the door closes if you nudge it during the opening sequence, having it be a door that you can open and close multiple times would solve this problem.

I have not seen the anime, so I can't judge the environment based on accuracy but I can based on playability, which really varied between really good and really bad.

I'm not trying to be overly critical, but I'm trying to supply constructive criticism to better the next version (which I await) and future maps you make.

EDIT: Also, it was a good idea to make this map for this mod, as many of the players enjoy anime and a field that is so suitable is rather hard to come by if you make your own mod, logically speaking.
Last edited by Philosogamer on Mon Jun 13, 2011 12:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: oc_NervA -Updated June11-

Post by fug4life »

Maestro Fénix wrote:I want accept the challenge. Where i should put it?
Put somewhere sensible, I'm sure W0rf0x or someone will move it if its in a stupid place.

Suggestion for what you should include.

really need more info about:

map_mounts.txts
map_modify.txts
map_cfg.txts
map_briefing,txts
map_soundscripts.txts
map_soundscapes.txts

merchant.txts
custom_weapon.txts

map version naming info suggestions i.e _b1, _b2 or _v1, _v2.

info about packing files and links to Pakrat, the .res file compiler and the .bspzip
info about what to pack into map and what to put into .res file and why they could be even friendlier and release the map in bspzip format.

I'm mean you could go on forever but generally a guide to make sure a map is fully server ready not just client playable.

Could even suggest mappers provide a 256x256 (best quality screenshot) compressed texture.vtfmaybe sample vmt aswell should server ops want to add the map to any lobby doors.

really mappers just need to realise that yes you can make very customised maps for this mod, and this should be encouraged in my opinion. But also they need to know this makes distribution of the map more complex and that they should strive to do as much as possible to make the package as accessible as possible to any potential server operators.

After all most mappers dreams are to have their maps up on servers with players enjoying their creation as hassle free as possible.

Also a bit about map_name_particle_manifest system oc has! Look at the directory for particles for more info I cant quote of the top of my head.
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